| nysirk21 |
| Posted 1/30/2008 3:28:40 AM |
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Active: 01-30-2008
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My cosin's family owned five dogs two lab/mixes one Shepard, and two pitt bulls, the two pittbulls are the youngest (father and baby) Both of the pittbulls grew up through puppiehood with the other three dogs They were a pack and all got along great. About two weeks ago my cosin let her dogs out in her yard as they always do, to her surprise she went to let her dogs in and only 4 of them returned and the two pittbulls had blood all over them, Horrified she went to investigate where her lab/mix Tucker was and she found him in her back yard all toren up, bloody and dead He was a VERY large aprox 70 pound labmix, I can't understand it. the youngest pittbull was not fixed and in heat Could that have played a role? the other pittbull is her father and they have a speical bond could this have been a factor in them killing their pack mate together? Another very unsettling fact is that the father pittbull had been through a 12 week obedience course by a professional Dog trainer,(his baby pittbull was never properly trained) I just can't understand how a trained Dog that grew up as a puppy with these dogs could kill there fellow packmate? Is aggression in dogs Gentic? I just don't understand what could make a Dog snap like that on its packmate, i feel horrible for my cosin and her family, they got rid of the youngest pittbull, but are going to keep the father pittbull and there remaining two dogs, I just don't understand it any one have any insight? |
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| CannonFarms |
| Posted 1/30/2008 6:49:21 AM |
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Active: 08-13-2006
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pits are prone to this, the pack isnt very well balanced if you have un neutered animals in the pack. The dogs didnt do it to be mean but all it would take is that Dog trying to pull rank or even getting hurt before and yelping, all dogs will pick on a down pack member, if two dogs are fighting and theres more around then the lesser fighter is going to get it from everybody. I cant imagine not hearing the screams from the other dog, and this is why it is said never leave a group of dogs alone unatended, you should never leave a Dog unwatched period. |
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| maoseger1010 |
| Posted 1/30/2008 7:58:04 AM |
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Forum Moderator
 
Active: 02-20-2005
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| Quote nysirk21: My cosin's family owned five dogs two lab/mixes one Shepard, and two pitt bulls, the two pittbulls are the youngest (father and baby) Both of the pittbulls grew up through puppiehood with the other three... |
Your cousin made a huge mistake by allowing a female who is in heat to run with other dogs in the yard. I get the impression you think the female started the fight, my guess is her being in heat started the fight. I note that you mention a "bond between the dogs" all bonds go out the window when a female Dog is in heat. Because Pits are well known for their lack of impulse control, what these dogs did was natural to them. The fault lays at the feet of your cousin, not the dogs.
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| maoseger1010 |
| Posted 1/30/2008 8:01:53 AM |
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Forum Moderator
Active: 02-20-2005
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| Quote CannonFarms: pits are prone to this, the pack isnt very well balanced if you have un neutered animals in the pack. The dogs didnt do it to be mean but all it would take is that Dog trying to pull rank or even getting... |
"I cant imagine not hearing the screams from the other dog"
Pit Bulls by instinct go for the throat so its very likly the Mix hardly made a sound. |
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| CannonFarms |
| Posted 1/30/2008 9:47:19 AM |
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Active: 08-13-2006
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when i had my american bulldogs they where constantly trying to fight if something just barely rubbed the other one the wrong way, hence why i dont have them anymore, but one thing, was the rest of the dogs would raise cane so you could hear something was up but on first contact isnt always at the throat, and the Dog usally gets out a yelp or two, and thats when the rest get involved. I love bully breeds but will never own one again, the three I had where all awesome dogs within themselves but together they didnt like anything but their little pack, It wound up I had to kennel them outside because of the other dogs i had at the time (this was when i was a breeder) and they could bite through the heavy gage chain link, which lead to the worst fight, all the others was stoppable scuffs, it was after that i rehomed them, but to, they are out of working hog dogs so they where a bit more intence than normal dogs.
The point is that you may not hear a scream, but you will hear the rest of the pack and I have never not been able to hear a Dog fight. |
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| suebgone |
| Posted 1/30/2008 4:13:19 PM |
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Active: 01-10-2006
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you have been given excellent info here & I wanted to answer one of your questions.
yes, genetics plays a very strong part of what a puppy becomes as an adult. no, it can't all be overcome by "giving them love".
pits are very unpredictable as mao said
it sounds like your cousin needs a lot of education about dogs & their behavior, this was her fault on several levels. |
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| nysirk21 |
| Posted 2/1/2008 12:06:56 AM |
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Active: 01-30-2008
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Thank you everyone for the input It helps me understand it much better, i agree she needs to learn much more about her dogs, The only reason I believe she didn't hear any of the dogs yelp is she has a very large house and it would be easy to not hear whats going on in the yard if she was inside, but i agree they should of never been unattended Hard lesson learned hopefully more Dog owners will read this and not make the same mistake i believe there is many breeds of dogs that should only be in the hands of experienced Dog handlers maybe someday a law will be passed for it can only hope, Thanks again for all the information |
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| kathystone |
| Posted 2/1/2008 2:42:40 AM |
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Active: 11-18-2007
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I am sorry for the traqic loss of your cousin's dog. However, it is a situation that your cousin caused.Any time a female Dog is in heat, the males will do whatever is necessary to breed her. The breed doesn't matter. Pit bulls are very strong dogs but you put a female in heat in a cage with an airedale, a pit, a rottwieler and an akita and you will end up with a female, a dead airedale, a dead pit and a bloody akita. I would recommmend that your cousin spay the female, neuter the males and keep the dogs separate until she/ he can be there to supervise them. It takes about 2 months for all the hormones to settle down.Even then, there is a pecking order in dogs and whoever is at the bottom may be in danger. This is why you can't usually keep several terriers in the same household. They gang up on the lower member and will kill that one and so forth until there are only 2 sometimes 3 dogs left. Then that group wil spar ever so often.
Think about it. Thanks! |
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| arachyd |
| Posted 2/1/2008 6:03:19 PM |
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Active: 05-09-2007
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Another thing to think about is your surprise that obedience trained dogs would do such a thing. Training only goes as far as the situation the Dog was trained for. A Dog trained to sit/stay/heel is not a Dog trained to ignore a threat or a female in heat. If the dogs were not specifically trained to never fight then their training would have no effect on that kind of situation. This is why we have to prepare for the unexpected and why it is so important that dogs not be left to their own devices as much as is humanly possible. Obedience training is priceless but is not the only requirement for keeping a Dog safe. |
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| maoseger1010 |
| Posted 2/1/2008 7:03:55 PM |
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Forum Moderator
Active: 02-20-2005
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| Quote arachyd: Another thing to think about is your surprise that obedience trained dogs would do such a thing. Training only goes as far as the situation the Dog was trained for. A Dog trained to sit/stay/heel is not... |
Excellent post. |
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| rambo2 |
| Posted 2/11/2008 9:07:58 PM |
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Active: 01-19-2008
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I am not the least surprised that the cousins didn't anticipate a problem -- we just lost a beloved Brittany Spaniel that was attacked and killed by the neighbor's dogs. The two intruders (this happened in front of our house, on our property)had squeezed under a fence and were on the prowl. The sad part is that my husband saw the dogs and was on his way out to intervene when the two much large dogs, a Mastiff and a Great Dane, pounced on our dog. It only took moments. We are naturally devastated.
The neighbor's defense was "I guess the mastiff was jealous or something." Oh yeah, it "wasn't his fault they got out".
These people have five dogs that often roam indiscriminately. They both work long hours and frankly, I can't see that any time can be spared for basic pet care, let alone training/socializing/control. They have agreed to build a kennel to contain all their animals. At least the neighors will be spared another 'incident'. |
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